tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-741227658356358863.post5844733425937977563..comments2023-09-21T09:49:28.326-07:00Comments on Fierce Dandelions: Gay Marriage: A Conservative Response to Conservative BigotryNathanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13920234350446745482noreply@blogger.comBlogger15125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-741227658356358863.post-64202090763592617802011-05-26T11:41:08.349-07:002011-05-26T11:41:08.349-07:00Adam above jokingly (I think jokingly) referred to...Adam above jokingly (I think jokingly) referred to me as a liberal attacking the sanctity of marriage, but really, most liberals wouldn't take me into their club. My views are too unruly. <br /><br />Here are a couple of examples to ponder. I have a retired friend who had a long and happy marriage with her husband, who is now deceased. She has been in a relationship for a few years with a newNathanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13920234350446745482noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-741227658356358863.post-6245501527692351132011-05-26T10:46:25.455-07:002011-05-26T10:46:25.455-07:00I guess you might say it gets into that whole impe...I guess you might say it gets into that whole impermanence thing. I have long wanted to have a lifelong companion, but at the same time, part of me wonders if the great prevalence of, and attachment to, that narrative - if that isn't just leading many of us to suffer greatly for entire lifetimes, either by staying with someone you've been miserable with for years on end, or by chasing Nathanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13920234350446745482noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-741227658356358863.post-36383901500490343672011-05-26T10:38:08.884-07:002011-05-26T10:38:08.884-07:00Richard, I have struggled to know what to think ab...Richard, I have struggled to know what to think about this issue for years. I have gay and bisexual friends who take a similar position as I'm taking here. I have others who take a position similar to yours. I know straight couples who won't get married as long as it is discriminatory towards the GLBTQ community. <br /><br />So, I really don't know what to think to be honest. <br /><Nathanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13920234350446745482noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-741227658356358863.post-8974267246374205112011-05-26T08:56:44.788-07:002011-05-26T08:56:44.788-07:00Nathan, I think I see where you're going with ...Nathan, I think I see where you're going with this, but I'm concerned about the vernacular.<br /><br />Marriage is marriage, whether its consecrated religiously or civilly. But a civil union is not marriage.<br /><br />I've written about this before, and I am anti-civil unions not just because they're not marriage, but because civil unions pose more danger to the institution of Richard Harroldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02943119066949899198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-741227658356358863.post-16200289581252974272011-05-26T08:24:23.105-07:002011-05-26T08:24:23.105-07:00Ok, I'm willing to admit that I don't have...Ok, I'm willing to admit that I don't have all the finer points of marriage history down. I was well aware of the property exchange piece, a practice that still is pretty easy to find around the world. I also was aware of the long history of "common law" marriages. <br /><br />Here's the thing. We can sit and debate the origins of marriage. We can sit and debate with muddledNathanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13920234350446745482noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-741227658356358863.post-17068299289129547602011-05-25T18:08:51.936-07:002011-05-25T18:08:51.936-07:00Yes Jack I got married in 1996 after living togeth...Yes Jack I got married in 1996 after living together for 4 years and divorced in 2005. I am the one who sued for the divorce. They even called us plaintiff and defendant on the papers. We remain friends and mutual supporters.NellaLouhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07247769132258539996noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-741227658356358863.post-17405403668486491652011-05-25T16:58:32.859-07:002011-05-25T16:58:32.859-07:00I have to agree with Richard. Marriage is not a re...I have to agree with Richard. Marriage is not a religious ceremony - it is a simply a civil one. It has been a part of society much longer than organized religion has, and religion has simply condoned the practice, not the other way around.d.sullivanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13779624094660497807noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-741227658356358863.post-36888180575036485442011-05-25T16:22:09.010-07:002011-05-25T16:22:09.010-07:00Hi Nathan, I must disagree with you that the roots...Hi Nathan, I must disagree with you that the roots of marriage "are tied directly to religious institutions." That's simply not true. Even in Biblical times, marriages were always arranged by the parents ahead of time, it was a contractual arrangement. The rabbi was brought in merely to conduct a public ceremony, but by the time of the ceremony, that marriage was contractually Richard Harroldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02943119066949899198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-741227658356358863.post-62455953222418327292011-05-25T15:12:56.919-07:002011-05-25T15:12:56.919-07:00Now here is a liberal that IS attacking the "...Now here is a liberal that IS attacking the "sanctimony" of marriage!!!<br /><br />Here in the Pacific Northwest, I'm finding that the term "partner" is becoming more and more common amongst straight couples. It's a bit sketchy as to how many are legally married or not. Some have just committed themselves to eachother, some have the paperwork to back it up. But I'mAdamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09688546442746669587noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-741227658356358863.post-41916741028107647832011-05-25T15:02:46.227-07:002011-05-25T15:02:46.227-07:00John,
You're right that officially, marriage ...John,<br /><br />You're right that officially, marriage isn't a religious ceremony. A straight couple can easily go down to a courthouse, for example, and get married.<br /><br />However, it's roots are tied directly to religious institutions. Go back far enough in history (probably not even too far), and you can't find anyone besides a priest officiating at a wedding. <br /><br /Nathanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13920234350446745482noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-741227658356358863.post-7614365504386734182011-05-25T14:11:31.160-07:002011-05-25T14:11:31.160-07:00NellaLou? You got divorced? Unthinkable...
love...NellaLou? You got divorced? Unthinkable...<br /><br /><br /><br />love you.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05764686989342179833noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-741227658356358863.post-51831883347173768702011-05-25T09:49:55.211-07:002011-05-25T09:49:55.211-07:00I see it too as a change in legal status since mos...I see it too as a change in legal status since most of what is affected by marriage relates to civil or legal issues such as taxation, powers of attorney, registration with the government, beneficiaries to benefits etc. Technically it is a contract that one requires a form of tort law to break. That is one partner must "sue" the other partner for a divorce. (at least that's what my NellaLouhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07247769132258539996noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-741227658356358863.post-69016352436445631312011-05-25T09:38:51.045-07:002011-05-25T09:38:51.045-07:00Sorry. Popping in again. Where is it codified in l...Sorry. Popping in again. Where is it codified in law that a marriage has to be religious. It only requires a state officiant.<br /><br />Am I incorrect in this?Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05764686989342179833noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-741227658356358863.post-24436115915591830852011-05-25T09:35:49.055-07:002011-05-25T09:35:49.055-07:00"Marriage is a religious ceremony"
Is i..."Marriage is a religious ceremony"<br /><br />Is it? I always thought it was a civil ceremony. People just feel the need to make it soemthing more. For example, my wife and I were married in the legal sense a day before our religiously-infused party/ceremony.<br /><br />That is why i just don't understand the insistance that this is a religious issue. It isn't. It is a civil oneAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05764686989342179833noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-741227658356358863.post-68237314491538230352011-05-25T09:24:37.532-07:002011-05-25T09:24:37.532-07:00I agree. Beats me why it doesn't already work ...I agree. Beats me why it doesn't already work like this. Would save a lot of bellyaching on all sides. I like the French PACS, only I think it should be the norm rather than an option. <br /><br />I also don't see any reason to restrict it to just two people; I think any number of adults should be able to form one, for any reason. Whether these reasons include tabs Y going into slots X Brikoleurhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01318706625291447339noreply@blogger.com